Why Distance Learning?

Seth Fleischauer (00:00.836)
Hello everyone and welcome to why distance learning the podcast that challenges misconceptions about live virtual education hosted by three seasoned distance learning professionals, myself, Tammy and Alison. Hello ladies. We bring you real stories, expert insights and research backs strategies that uncover the true impact of distance learning in today's world. Today's episode zooms in on a topic that tends to raise some eyebrows.

Tami Moehring (00:12.901)
Hello.

Seth Fleischauer (00:28.024)
which is teaching our youngest learners online. While many assume that kindergartners can't thrive in virtual settings, today's guest proves that it's not only possible, it can be powerful. Nancy Grimm has been an educator in Tucson, Arizona for 16 years with six of those years dedicated to teaching in online settings. She spent most of her career teaching, sorry.

She spent most of her virtual teaching career working with kindergarten students and now teaches second grade at Tucson Unified Virtual Academy, a K-12 online school. Nancy discovered during the pandemic that her gift for engaging young learners translated surprisingly well to the virtual world. And that's where she's chosen to stay. Through humor, creativity, and deep intention, she's figured out what makes virtual classrooms work for kids who are just beginning their academic journeys. Nancy, welcome to the program.

Miss Nancy Grim (01:21.206)
Hi, thank you for having me.

Seth Fleischauer (01:23.85)
And for a more formal introduction, Tammy, could you please introduce our guest?

Tami Moehring (01:28.493)
I'd happy to. Nancy Graham has been teaching in Tucson, Arizona for 16 years with six of those years being online for those working for the Tucson Unified Virtual Academy, a K-12 school. She is currently a second grade virtual teacher. However, most of her virtual experience has been with teaching kindergarten. It was during the COVID pandemic that she realized she had the ability to engage and teach students virtually and that online education was where she needed to be to have the biggest teaching impact.

Allyson (01:52.673)
You

Seth Fleischauer (01:59.012)
And we're giggling because Nancy's currently showing us a puppet because she's an online kindergarten teacher.

Tami Moehring (01:59.099)
So.

Allyson (02:01.87)
you

Tami Moehring (02:04.431)
Exactly, she would have that. Way to throw my whole intro off, Nancy. Well, with that in mind, and your wonderful puppet there, let's go ahead and kick it off with the first question, which is teaching kindergartens virtually sounds like a huge challenge to many people. What are some of the creative strategies or tools you use to keep such young learners engaged in learning online?

Miss Nancy Grim (02:29.655)
Miss Graham, they're talking to you. You need to come back. Miss Graham. Okay. Hi. So puppets. Anytime I need a sub, sometimes a puppet has to step in. So a lot of it with the Kinders is just being creative and innovative and puppets and voices.

Seth Fleischauer (02:37.22)
You had me there for a moment.

Allyson (02:40.128)
Yeah, I was read I'm like I'm so excited right now

Allyson (02:57.793)
You

Miss Nancy Grim (02:58.519)
Going online though to begin with with tinder's they don't really know how to use technology yet or understand things. There's a lot of like visuals of this is how we need to share screen or this is how we need to chat. For me what I really gravitated towards first though was the puppets but it was for me not so much for the kids because I missed having the banter with you know students every now and then. So we were reading a story about sheeps on a ship

and I had some puppets behind me and I had two of the same duck ones because the school bought me one and then I got one at the yard at a yard sale. So I literally took a Sharpie and turned it into a pirate duck. There we go. So then right afterwards that duck got to explain like how like upset it was that sheeps were being pirates and I'm supposed to be the pirate, not the sheep. Pirates are ducks.

Seth Fleischauer (03:55.172)
Of course, everybody knows that.

Miss Nancy Grim (03:55.958)
But I have to leave now because now I have to go pick up my ducklings on the ship. So bye. So the different puppets would come and then the kids would want to talk to the puppets and have questions for the puppets. And it was just so much fun and they were getting so engaged and they would be getting their siblings or their siblings would be walking by and they'd like want to stop and watch. So would the parents.

Allyson (04:14.391)
you

Miss Nancy Grim (04:21.879)
Why is there a rake in my hat? You know, lots of props. I'm very much a prop teacher and there are no sheeps on this ship, but there's also a ship in my hat and this hat is just so amazing. My hat has a cake. My hat has a book and a fish. The fish is fine. My hair is a mess though. And the little man.

Seth Fleischauer (04:25.059)
You

Allyson (04:45.912)
That's what said.

Miss Nancy Grim (04:51.191)
and the fan and the dress. So it was really looking at things that I had. These are from like a board game I had. I had the Dr. Seuss hat, so I was able to fill it up. And so the kids just never know what to expect, because I'm sure you didn't realize there were things hiding in my hat. Right! It is!

Allyson (05:06.286)
No, I loved it. I was like, it's like Mary Poppins bag, but a hat. Yeah.

Seth Fleischauer (05:06.936)
Not that many things.

Tami Moehring (05:08.741)
No

Tami Moehring (05:12.965)
I can only imagine what is not on screen with you right now, Nancy, and what is hidden underneath your desk.

Seth Fleischauer (05:17.572)
You

Allyson (05:19.854)
just thinking the same thing, Tammy. I was like, oh my gosh, what is around you? I just love pictures of your closets with all of your things. It's so fun.

Miss Nancy Grim (05:28.459)
I have no idea what could be under my desk or on my desk or around that would help to engage you with this podcast conversation or your online learning. So a lot of it was looking at the curriculum. We had a math presentation where the kids had like a pretend cake and adding candles and taking away candles as we rolled the dice. So of course we're rolling the dice virtually, but.

Allyson (05:37.966)
you

Miss Nancy Grim (05:54.472)
Afterwards, I actually had candles and lit them and then we counted to three and then off camera I blew them out. The kids totally thought it was them. They loved watching the smoke. They thought like they blew so hard. Like even I was like, stop blowing so hard. so just a lot of animation really kind of queuing into my theater experience, learning about colors, you know, I had them close their eyes and they had, you know.

Allyson (06:03.098)
Yes! Yes!

Seth Fleischauer (06:03.203)
Yeah.

Miss Nancy Grim (06:20.011)
picture that everything is red right now and I had 3D glasses so I thought, hey, let's break these glasses and turn everything red so when they come back. right now we're gonna close our eyes and pretend everything's green and wow, when you look, everything in my background is green. Now this is very scratched up so it's very hard to see but if it wasn't scratched up, you would totally understand and see clearly how to do the color. So with the 3D glasses, we could only focus on red, blue and purple.

Sound effects are also the thing I had these like little buzzers and it lights up and then I don't know if you heard that or not. Perfect and I have like this other one which at the time I had like a student who was obsessed with farts and he'd be like I farted on you in person which is why I bought it. It was just once. So then I bought this because it had like a little farting noise.

Allyson (06:57.047)
Yes!

Seth Fleischauer (06:57.41)
We did.

Seth Fleischauer (07:05.476)
Yeah, sure. Just one student.

Allyson (07:08.174)
I

Miss Nancy Grim (07:17.311)
And I could use this a lot, just sound effects. I really wish I had like a soundboard, but different things like props if we're like listening to music, I've got my air guitar, I've got my magic wand. That's not being very magical at the moment. There we go, delayed response. know, clear itself, so here's like a giant Easter egg for around Easter time. And then we crack it open.

Allyson (07:30.69)
Yes! Yes! Yay!

Miss Nancy Grim (07:47.512)
And then, oh, there's some like miniature eggs inside in a sentence. So help me fix this sentence of, love online teaching. And if you could actually see it, the I need to be capitalized. We need an exclamation point. There's eggs. One of the eggs already opened, but I can tell the kids to pick. Do you want the pink one or the green one? So audience, would you like the pink or the green one? Green, okay.

Seth Fleischauer (08:00.9)
Thanks

Allyson (08:02.786)
Yes!

Seth Fleischauer (08:12.238)
Green.

Allyson (08:13.784)
Green.

Miss Nancy Grim (08:16.459)
So here is, hmm, I don't know, we have to scratch it off. Let me scratch and see what it is.

Miss Nancy Grim (08:28.575)
It is our sight word! Can you tell me what that sight word says? might be backwards. B-E-C-A. Yes, it is because! And the pink one that you didn't choose!

Allyson (08:35.906)
Because!

Seth Fleischauer (08:39.022)
Good job, Allison.

Allyson (08:40.024)
Thanks.

Miss Nancy Grim (08:43.785)
It is a math problem. What is seven times two?

Seth Fleischauer (08:45.412)
Hmm

Allyson (08:48.502)
team. This is exciting!

Seth Fleischauer (08:49.348)
You're so good, Allison.

Miss Nancy Grim (08:50.165)
That is so amazing! Because of that, the dinosaurs do not need to come and get you! Like, we are so safe from all the dinosaurs. But I heard that the gorillas and the wolves might be coming soon, so we need to be careful. So, little things like that. Lots of props is one of the ways that I decided to engage my students.

Seth Fleischauer (08:57.315)
Seth Fleischauer (09:00.9)
you

Seth Fleischauer (09:14.958)
So at this point, yeah.

Allyson (09:15.23)
my goodness, I wanna come learn from you. Like, just wanna, let's start a lesson right now.

Miss Nancy Grim (09:18.166)
You

Seth Fleischauer (09:20.845)
Like typically in the podcast we follow that up with more questions, but can you just keep going?

Miss Nancy Grim (09:20.896)
Hahaha

Allyson (09:25.728)
Yeah, did you put more challenges in? That was so fun.

Seth Fleischauer (09:29.828)
you

Miss Nancy Grim (09:31.837)
That was like my whole gamut of stuff that I had nearby prepared for this presentation.

Seth Fleischauer (09:39.368)
All right, so maybe, yeah, you go, yes.

Allyson (09:40.162)
My goodness. okay. Yeah. I'm just so excited. I'm like literally want to design programs with you. I wanna come watch all your programs. I wanna see your prop closet. But to think about your amazing career. So you have been teaching for 16 years in Tucson, Arizona. And you, six of those were online. And that was because of the pandemic you said was when you went online?

Miss Nancy Grim (09:43.873)
Hahaha

Miss Nancy Grim (10:08.181)
The pandemic is what started it for about two of those years. Yeah.

Allyson (10:10.062)
started. Okay, two of the years. well, nice that you found another medium for you to share your wonderful teaching skills. So I wonder, was there a time during that shift? Because it was such a, you know, the digital pivot was the pivot of all life for so many. So I wondered, was there any specific moment where you were like, yeah, this really shows that I can thrive as a virtual educator?

I got this a certain time that you were like, I'm going to stay in the virtual and not go back to the in-person.

Miss Nancy Grim (10:43.841)
So I didn't even know that staying virtual was an option at that time. I just knew based on feedback that, you know, my coworkers weren't loving it. They were struggling with how to teach certain things, how to keep their kids engaged and in front of the computer. It's so hard when you're competing with television or the books or the toys nearby. So just hearing that and how I wasn't having some of those issues that they were having.

Allyson (10:46.872)
Mmm.

Miss Nancy Grim (11:09.143)
Parents were also sending me emails because, you know, a lot of their kids were scared because of the pandemic. And it's so nice to hear my child laughing like for most of the day and they're learning and they're bringing me to the computer. My principal even said to me that observing my teaching was like watching Mr. Rogers and that really solidified it and meant a lot to me. She also liked that beyond Mr. Rogers, my students could talk to me and I could talk to them. So we were having really good.

conversations. I was also really good with the transitions of screen sharing and having the curriculum ready. So I wasn't losing a lot of that learning time that was essential during the pandemic. So part of that was like, you know, I'm pretty good at this. So I need to do this because before I never wanted to teach online, but being forced to do it, I learned that I could.

Seth Fleischauer (11:57.22)
Hmm.

Allyson (12:00.494)
Mmm.

Yeah, and you can be Mr. Rogers and also be like, Hey TV, no competition, they're focusing on me. Like, yay.

Seth Fleischauer (12:03.78)
Mm.

Miss Nancy Grim (12:08.503)
Yes!

Seth Fleischauer (12:13.86)
I wonder about like those other teachers who were struggling and whether or not you were able to communicate to them some things that helped them versus like what clearly is like a natural talent and like a personality driven approach to this medium. I'm wondering, you know, for those that were struggling, were they able to pick up some of your tips and tricks?

Miss Nancy Grim (12:38.647)
With getting stuff kind of front loaded and ready for those quick screen shares, they would do that. Or sometimes they'd bring up a YouTube song or a YouTube story. But what I've been doing here, a lot of it was out of their personality comfort zone. So some of them would maybe use eggs to crack things open or put different things in different places. But it was really hard to get them to.

embrace it still, you know, and it was it was a forced thing. So there wasn't a lot of accountability with how they did. It was just, you know, here's the curriculum, teach it how you can teach it.

Allyson (13:17.176)
That idea of like playfulness, being playful in the way that you're providing the curriculum during a hard time might get the best, Yeah.

Seth Fleischauer (13:17.593)
Yeah.

Miss Nancy Grim (13:22.623)
Yeah, well, and especially with kindergarten, because we have a lot of parents there as well, and they're watching you. And I know teachers struggle the most when they have to speak in front of the parents and other adults. So knowing that you're being watched and judged by them too was kind of a hindrance for some of those teachers as well.

Seth Fleischauer (13:42.83)
man, I did a New York City teaching fellows. It's like Teach for America for New York. And we had this day in like the summer prep before we started teaching. And they gave us all like a personality test. And I've I have a pretty outgoing personality. I've done a lot of puppets like I do. I use a lot of props when I teach like even with older kids like you know, it's

It's just more interesting, right? Because they can't see what's around you until it pops up in front of them. it's like a magic trick, right? It can keep them engaged so that you can then deal with the content. But I was surprised that in this personality test, they had us all go into the corners of who's an orange, and who's a blue, and who's a red. And I was in the corner with three other people out of a group of 100.

Allyson (14:27.138)
Hahaha

Seth Fleischauer (14:32.682)
and like most of the teachers were introverts, which I thought was really interesting for a profession of people that talk for a living, right? But there is this sense that you are, you you're up in front of people, yes, but you're also like in control of your little kingdom, right? Or at least, you know, facilitating from the side in your community, we'll call it, but there is this element of like,

Allyson (14:40.942)
Hehehehehe

Miss Nancy Grim (14:41.591)
you

Seth Fleischauer (15:00.6)
you it's, it's a place where at least you don't have to be in front of other adults. And, and I do think that that was, as you said, like a really tricky part of the pandemic for people was this like, my gosh, not only am I being observed, but I'm being observed by like non teachers and all of them at once. And I can't see them, you know, like that, that was, that was tough for a lot of people, but obviously, you know, you really shined with it because the

Allyson (15:05.166)
Mm.

Miss Nancy Grim (15:21.018)
Yes.

Seth Fleischauer (15:30.468)
proof is in the pudding if the kids are laughing and paying attention in this what was otherwise an incredibly difficult time for most teachers. Yeah, like you obviously shined. And I wonder now that you're teaching older kids, you're teaching second graders, do you still shine? you still use the same approaches is do you have to like tone it down a little bit? Or is it is it like, do you what do you find the difference between those grade levels?

Miss Nancy Grim (15:56.632)
So toning me down is very challenging. So no, I do not tone it down. I am who I am. That's exactly how I'm going to be. But like with the students, they're bringing more of their creative aspect into it too. I even had it with kindergartners where, you know, they'd bring their like toys on and for show and tell, and they'd make like a stuffed animal talk that wasn't even a puppet.

Seth Fleischauer (15:58.594)
Yeah

Allyson (15:59.086)
Yes! Yes!

Miss Nancy Grim (16:25.175)
and change their voice a little bit. I'd have them, like one of them even brought a toy and the toy chose like if it was a dog, for example, the dog chose like a toy cat that it liked. And so the dog like presented this cat to the whole class for show and tell instead of the kid. So I'm like, okay, you skipped your show and tell and give it to your stuffed animal. So a lot of the creativity is what I've seen from the second graders. you know, they,

Allyson (16:39.277)
Hahaha

Miss Nancy Grim (16:53.079)
they can read more so you know they're trying to like do the different voices now too and yeah a lot of that.

Allyson (17:02.38)
gosh that they I Tammy and I have had the lovely pleasure and privilege to be able to see and miss Nancy in action and her students specifically during in the community of learning program they are so they're rock stars they're always answering questions so engaged but also like saying good job to their to the people that are also answering the questions in the chat they feel so comfortable

Being able not only to communicate, but also ask the questions, make the comments. So it's so beautiful to see all of your energy really come through in the times Tammy and I've gotten to witness it during Community of Learning.

Miss Nancy Grim (17:43.148)
And they want to make sure that you know that they are there. Like, because they all come up as Miss Grimm or Miss Grimm second grade students and they're like, hi, I'm Jo or hi, I'm Sarah. So, you know, they're making sure that like, know exactly who they are and that they are there participating with you.

Allyson (17:51.829)
Yes!

Allyson (17:59.7)
I'm it's it's so lovely too because when you get to see all those hellos and letting us know what grade they're in and where they're coming from, it's just so lovely. And they're really just a great, great, wonderful group of students. It is funny to think about the idea of something coming off state, you know, coming off of your virtual box out of your virtual box, if you will, because before the pandemic, I feel like that used to be a strategy to protect to make sure everyone knew you were a YouTube video. You could like throw your hand out or jump on

screen. it's cool to think about all the other props that have come up. But I'm wondering just in general with your experiences, is there an example of a student that confirmed to you that online education can really make a big impact? You've been able to work with the younger student population, so they grow so much in like the time you get them from the start to the end of the year during those ages. Not that everyone does, but the idea that you get to see so

much growth. So I wonder if there's something that sticks out for you.

Miss Nancy Grim (19:03.423)
Yeah, so I do want to kind of go back to the first question though to like readdress like how the second graders are a bit different from the kindergartners. They are definitely taking ownership and they love to teach new students that come in. Like they want to screen share and they can screen share. So if a new student joins my class, I can just put them in a breakout room and they can show the student exactly how to like share screen, how to meet themselves, how to unmute themselves, how to turn in an assignment. They also love to share timer, so they'll pick a timer.

and they'll share it with the class. And then I could still look up whatever I need to on all my screens and not have to worry about accidentally sharing something I don't want to share. So, you know, they're just so helpful and becoming so independent and like they're doing lots of Google searches on their own. Like the wildfires in California, could like we read a story about it, which wasn't even part of it, but they wanted to like talk about it. And we talked about hurricanes at the beginning because that was part of the curriculum. So, you know, we focused on reading a story about wildfires. And then they were like showing me maps of the

Allyson (19:36.877)
You

you

Miss Nancy Grim (20:02.609)
know, wildfires in California and different things that they were finding online, you know, with their little, you know, Google searches that they were learning how to do themselves. And the students are just really in tune with one another. I had a student who when they would get upset, they would turn off their camera and they would like cuss me out and all that. And so I switched it to like, okay, I'm going to mute you, but you can send me emojis, like direct message me those emojis. That way I know you are feeling strong feelings and I can

you know, acknowledge that and validate you with those. And this kid had to go to several different appointments. And they didn't have the best internet connection in their car. they were they had all the kids had earned like a prize. So they were, you know, playing some online game together virtually. And their camera was off. But what had happened is this kid sent a crying emoji and then logged off. So immediately one of the kids calls me in and they're like, you need to contact them right now.

They sent a crying emoji. I think something is wrong. And I thought nothing of it. Like, I figured they were just upset because they had to leave. They were at their appointment. But no, like, this kid was actually, like, very upset. Like, they had to go to the bathroom in the car. And, there's too much traffic. That's what it was. So no, they were, actually trying to communicate with the others and express, you know, like, they were very upset at that time. And so it was nice that the student queued into that and then alerted me to that because I wasn't in that breakout room at the time to know that.

So that's also a great thing about second graders because the kinders, you know, they're not quite in tune with each other yet. They're very self-focused still from their kindergarten. But really what has stood out to me with online teaching.

A lot of it is just knowing that that's what I needed to do. But it's kind of with that same student who I would have send me those emojis privately. Sometimes we need to talk about it and discuss like how what they were doing was not okay, better strategies to do it. And they were still very upset and agitated, but it was lunchtime now. So it was really the only time I could talk to them. So I was able to change to an avatar, an animal avatar.

Miss Nancy Grim (22:17.579)
And they respond, they're like, why are you a dog now? But that defused the situation. And then they were able to talk to me because then they didn't have the like physical, facial expressions that I was giving or my body language to go off of. So, you know, they didn't feel as threatened as they might have. And this was a student who hated making mistakes. And that honestly would set them off. But over time, the student

was fine making mistakes. They would laugh and it was like a little simple mistake and they like realized what they did wrong. And then also they learned, you mistakes were okay even if they had to redo their entire problem. So like that was really a moment that stood out for me in online teaching.

Seth Fleischauer (22:57.166)
Hmm. Miss Nancy, one of the things we like to do in this podcast is keep the conversation going a bit by bringing in quotes from previous episodes and seeing how they resonate with our guests. Tammy, could you tee that up for Miss Nancy?

Tami Moehring (23:10.285)
I'd be happy to. So we had on the podcast, Desiree Maassar, and she paraphrased a great quote that said, distance learning doesn't limit joy, it actually gives you more tools to build it. So how does that resonate with you as an online teacher?

Miss Nancy Grim (23:33.932)
So I smiled when you said that because like, feel like it does resonate with me. I had puppets in my classroom teaching in person, but I wasn't using them as often, but like being able to change my, know, and here's my puppet. Like I'm a really good ventriloquist because you don't see it that I'm talking over here on the side because you're only looking at my hand. And then also during the pandemic, like I'd be like, like,

Allyson (23:46.494)
Hahaha!

Seth Fleischauer (23:52.068)
you

Miss Nancy Grim (23:59.296)
I'd play the doorbell sound. And so then like, we have a guest. So I'd have to put on my mask. So then with the face mask, they also can't see that I'm moving my lips at the time while I'm moving my hand. there are just so many tools now. books, there's YouTube recordings of books so kids can hear not just the female reading, which is me, their teacher, but like a male voice reading or a voice with an accent that I don't have.

That's also one reason why I really love the online programs is because they're seeing all different sorts of teachers and presenters and different ways that people present and engage them. It's not just me. So like if they're bored and tired of me and my energy, like somebody else can bring it down a bit or somebody else might have more energy than me. Thinking of Marty Chan, like he's so out of there.

Allyson (24:43.316)
Never!

Seth Fleischauer (24:47.49)
I think you just personally offended Allison.

Allyson (24:49.806)
Like keep the energy, always keep the energy up, yes.

Seth Fleischauer (24:55.652)
Alison, sorry, keep going.

Miss Nancy Grim (24:55.723)
And then like, like NFTs, like I still don't fully understand NFTs, but like people are spending lots of money for these like images. I can honestly copy and paste random images and then like my kids can take that and make that their profile picture or their background, or they can do that themselves. So there's a little bit of that going on too.

Seth Fleischauer (25:01.924)
Yeah.

Allyson (25:15.214)
You're so creative. I love it so much. It's great to hear also that you had mentioned you have a theater background. You have a background in theater. So yeah, it's cool to see that all come in to bring that all in. And I know we typically do do the golden moment in distance learning and you have shared some amazing golden moments. So I wonder if we could also ask one other question, which is about the future of

Seth Fleischauer (25:23.0)
you don't say.

Miss Nancy Grim (25:24.599)
You

Allyson (25:41.198)
like looking to the future of K-12 education. Specifically with you having the knowledge and experience of being in-person successful, virtual successful, even when you have, you know, every three, I always say teacher is the first year you learn to survive, the second year we learn our content, the third year we actually get to teach. So in those types of ideas, when you look to the future, do you...

want to see more schools and educators embrace virtual learning. And if you want to throw in another golden moment in that question, please feel free to. I just think that I just would love to see and hear a little bit more about what you hope for the future and see for the future.

Miss Nancy Grim (26:21.111)
More virtual stuff is popping up constantly. So whether or not I want it to happen, schools and people and teachers and students and parents all need to embrace this. Yes, 100 % I want it to happen, for it to be successful to happen. Yay, luckily we already have people super successful at it. But really colleges and the teacher prep, colleges and teacher preparation programs need to change.

they need to offer an online teaching option to those teachers because there are the jobs are limited, but there's still jobs out there. And the skills that a teacher needs are very different online than what they need in person. Classroom management looks a bit different. Classroom engagement looks a bit different. Like the strategies are completely different. Some of the stuff does overlap, but like with education, there's higher ed, there's

Regular education there's early childhood education now. There's special education. So they really do need to offer online education For teachers for those teachers who do want to commit to teaching online and also They could do an endorsement as well because lots of endorsements have been added on so that way teachers can learn like I'm really bad at this but I can focus on this area like student engagement. I don't know student engagement

Allyson (27:19.575)
Hahaha

Miss Nancy Grim (27:46.432)
I can go specifically to a class for the three months or whatever and learn how to really engage my students. There are some professional developments that help with that, but people need to be in it and experiencing it and then possibly even being observed doing it. Also, I got my principal certification about two years ago and my professor wouldn't let me do an online.

Allyson (28:08.824)
Congratulations!

Miss Nancy Grim (28:15.027)
principal observation, I had to go in person. And, you know, they just didn't think that an online principal has to deal with as many of the things that a in person principal does. Well, they do, there's still a lot of the same things teachers who are resistant to doing things, students who are still having behavior issues, parents who are unhappy about something or parents who want more. You know, so it's basically a lot of the same demands.

that were there. And what I liked about that, getting my principal certification is I had that same teacher throughout the two year process. So they really got to come to understand what Tuva was all about and see that, oh, online schooling is not what I thought it was because they totally thought it was like fluff, but really there's a lot of meat and sustenance to it, you know, because our kids go all day. They're there from like 8, 10 to 2 30.

Allyson (29:05.197)
you

Miss Nancy Grim (29:11.439)
and learning everything that everybody else is learning. that was, you know, it was sad to see that like they didn't give a lot of credit to that, but like changing their opinion. So I think with education changing and it being focused on more, think online teachers will get more credit because a lot of people are like, it's so nice that you get to stay home.

Okay, but I have to figure out like I can't give them a worksheet. I can't give it like I have to figure out how to make them have access to the curriculum to be able to turn it in to be able to get feedback. So, you know, yeah, online teachers need a bit more credit. My golden moment, it was after the pandemic teaching at the online school for the first time. And we were learning about Dia de los Muertos because we have a huge Catholic population in southern Arizona. And I honestly didn't know much about it.

And so we're talking about Dia de los Muertos and then the kids like, you mean this. And they took their computer over and they were showing me an ofrenda. And like, there's my mom, she's alive, there's my aunt, she's dead. That's why it's there, that picture. Like it was a very important moment. So they were sharing with us a part of their culture live in their house. And then another kid was like, I have one too. And other kids were like, I don't have one. But you know,

Seth Fleischauer (30:15.427)
Mm-hmm.

Miss Nancy Grim (30:34.571)
they really got to own what we were learning about and they made that connection. And I see a lot of that happening learning virtually. If I'm teaching about spiders, my kids will leave their computer and I'm like, why? But then I give it a minute and I'm seeing books about spiders or I'm seeing toy spiders or I'm seeing the pet spider. So the kids are really connecting to what we're talking about.

Tami Moehring (30:56.581)
Ugh.

Seth Fleischauer (31:01.374)
that's awesome. And I think it does speak to some of the why behind why distance learning. But I'll pose this question to you. The title of our podcast, Miss Nancy, why distance learning?

Miss Nancy Grim (31:14.913)
Technology and the science fields are where so much innovation is happening and it's going to keep happening. And our students need to be prepared for that. And being virtual, they get to be like right there on the front lines because they see programs that they're using being updated and advancing and programs being filtered out and new programs coming in. So when they're working, they'll see like,

Allyson (31:34.062)
You

Miss Nancy Grim (31:44.054)
I had this great idea and people used it and then it went away. But I can have this other great idea or I can improve upon my idea. Like the editing process is so important. So really because of technology and science is why distance learning, but also especially with CILC and other programs that are out there. My students are able to network with so many different people in different cities, different states, different countries and

You know, because we go so much, people are learning who my students are and their personalities and our learning community is so much larger than just our small classroom like it was for when I was growing up. So these kids really see and have that world global connection.

Seth Fleischauer (32:28.484)
Before we let you go, Tammy, Allison, do you guys have any last thoughts or questions for Ms. Nancy?

Allyson (32:36.568)
I just wanted to say thank you so much. You are such a ball of energy. my goodness. I want to meet you in person and go do fun, exciting things and teach. Yeah, it'll be so exciting.

Miss Nancy Grim (32:46.455)
haha

Seth Fleischauer (32:46.584)
That would be like crossing the streams in Ghostbusters. I think the universe might explode.

Miss Nancy Grim (32:49.495)
She's not playing it! She's doing good!

Allyson (32:52.652)
Be so good. And I really appreciate all the opportunities to learn from you today and also from in the past from your students. So thank you so much for all you do. I can't wait to see all of your rock star students go on to be such amazing individuals.

Tami Moehring (33:08.123)
That, yes, thank you so much, Nancy. This is a lot of fun. I loved seeing everything you had. I can only imagine what is hidden. Every time one of your students pops up on screen with your name, I'm going to think of a puppet. So thank you for that positive image and it's great. So, my goodness. On the screen, Nancy is showing so many things I can't, that is,

Allyson (33:21.646)
Yes.

Miss Nancy Grim (33:21.761)
Hahaha

Allyson (33:26.856)
yes!

Miss Nancy Grim (33:27.681)
There. Puppets down there.

Allyson (33:31.68)
All the puppets. Tammy, your mind is...

Seth Fleischauer (33:33.07)
That's a lot of puppets.

Miss Nancy Grim (33:34.019)
Lots of puppets. And then there's like a closet of costumes back there too, because like I used to dress up in person and I still dress up online.

Allyson (33:43.738)
Yes! my gosh. Tammy, this is an example of why you can always repurpose things too. Just reminders. No. They all have a purpose.

Seth Fleischauer (33:49.718)
Meh, don't ever throw anything away. Ever. Yeah.

Tami Moehring (33:50.629)
Yes.

Miss Nancy Grim (33:51.864)
No, no teacher hoarding culture!

Tami Moehring (33:54.608)
My-

Tami Moehring (33:58.491)
I am having a little bit of anxiety with the amount of magic you have, only because I tend to let it go on to a second life somewhere, not by me. But it is amazing to see it. I love it all. It reminds me of my daughter's room and all the endless amount of creativity and things that she, and also your personality. My daughter had a great first grade teacher when the pandemic started and just having someone

who went above and beyond and made her want to connect did so much that she remembers that teacher, even though she didn't have her physically in the classroom every single day, one of her top teachers still goes back to when they were in person every day would go into a room and say, hey, I love it, what are you doing? And then that just shows, you're a great teacher all around. So thank you for being with us today.

Seth Fleischauer (34:54.82)
If you're having fun, they're having fun. And if you care, if you really care, they will care. Right. And you like absolutely communicate that over this medium. I love it. Thank you so much, Ms. Nancy for being here. For our listeners, if you've ever questioned whether young learners can thrive in an online environment, Nancy Grimm's work offers a compelling answer. Her creativity. What's that? They can. Yeah.

Miss Nancy Grim (34:55.031)
Thank you for having me. Yes.

Tami Moehring (34:58.039)
Exactly.

Miss Nancy Grim (35:02.135)
Mm-hmm.

Miss Nancy Grim (35:07.201)
Thank you.

Miss Nancy Grim (35:17.813)
They can do it.

Allyson (35:19.086)
Yes!

Miss Nancy Grim (35:21.025)
They can do it.

Seth Fleischauer (35:24.576)
yes, they can. and you know, your creativity, your empathy, your commitment to building these joyful virtual classrooms remind us that distance learning isn't just a workaround. It's a vibrant human centered way to teach and connect. you can check the show notes listeners for more about Tucson Unified Virtual Academy and the practices Nancy uses to support her early learners online. Thank you as always to our editor, Lucas Salazar. If this

Allyson (35:51.544)
Thank you. Yes!

Miss Nancy Grim (35:52.395)
Yay Lucas!

Seth Fleischauer (35:53.476)
If this episode sparked a new way of thinking, please share it with a colleague, follow the show or leave us a review. Your support helps more educators discover the real stories that are shaping the future of virtual learning. Curious about what's really possible in live virtual education? Keep listening. These are the voices transforming distance learning one bold idea at a time. Why distance learning? Because it's personal, powerful and here to stay. See you next time.

Miss Nancy Grim (36:22.392)
Bye.